Does anyone know if fheroes2 changed the difficulty (either intentionally or unintentionally) of any of the price of loyalty campaign maps?
I have been trying to play map 2 of pol campaign in fheroes2, but it seems much, much more difficult than I remember it being in the original heroes 2 game.
For example, by week 2 I am already seeing a half-dozen enemy heroes with armies of lots, lots, lots, pack, horde.
This doesn't seem do-able. Maybe this is an unintentional side-effect of meddling with the AI?
Confirm? Clarify?
**Addendum**
I also noticed that in one of the wizard isles campaign maps there was an issue where an enemy hero with a super powerful starting army would often portal directly to your starting area around turn 6 or 7 and at that point it was basically impossible to win because he would attack you right away and it was pretty much literally impossible to beat that army without cheating. You had to keep reloading until the random teleport network didn't happen to take him directly to your portal next to your castle so you could have enough time to build up a decent army. I can't say I ever played this wizard isle campaign map, originally, but I can't believe this was the way that map was intended to play out originally.
Does anyone know if fheroes2 changed the difficulty (either intentionally or unintentionally) of any of the price of loyalty campaign maps?
I have been trying to play map 2 of pol campaign in fheroes2, but it seems much, much more difficult than I remember it being in the original heroes 2 game.
For example, by week 2 I am already seeing a half-dozen enemy heroes with armies of lots, lots, lots, pack, horde.
This doesn't seem do-able. Maybe this is an unintentional side-effect of meddling with the AI?
Confirm? Clarify?
**Addendum**
I also noticed that in one of the wizard isles campaign maps there was an issue where an enemy hero with a super powerful starting army would often portal directly to your starting area around turn 6 or 7 and at that point it was basically impossible to win because he would attack you right away and it was pretty much literally impossible to beat that army without cheating. You had to keep reloading until the random teleport network didn't happen to take him directly to your portal next to your castle so you could have enough time to build up a decent army. I can't say I ever played this wizard isle campaign map, originally, but I can't believe this was the way that map was intended to play out originally.
Hi, phamtrinil!
The AI is completely remade from scratch in fheroes2 since the whole engine is remade, none of the original source code is used. In other words the original AI hasn't been meddled with since it is not even present.
The maps you're mentioning are still beatable by following very specific tactics, basically the same as you would in the original game for the second map of the Price of Loyalty(PoL) campaign: get creatures fast and by the second week you should have gone north and started taking over castles. Use a barbarian hero, so reload until you get that. These are the same steps guides for the original game give. Many of those scenarios were badly designed originally imo and forced you to save and reload to get the better spells etc.
The new AI is better in many places but still needs to be improved. However, the PoL campaign was probably balanced specifically for the often dumb original AI so that any human opponent taking its place would have a ridiculous advantage against you, just take a look at all the resource boosts the AI gets from scripts by opening campaign maps in the editor and you will understand what I'm talking about.
Nevertheless, there are talks about making changes so that the original unfair advantages of the AI are lessened.
BTW the last release made it possible to choose different difficulties for the campaigns so you could try that.
Does anyone know if fheroes2 changed the difficulty (either intentionally or unintentionally) of any of the price of loyalty campaign maps?
I have been trying to play map 2 of pol campaign in fheroes2, but it seems much, much more difficult than I remember it being in the original heroes 2 game.
For example, by week 2 I am already seeing a half-dozen enemy heroes with armies of lots, lots, lots, pack, horde.
This doesn't seem do-able. Maybe this is an unintentional side-effect of meddling with the AI?
Confirm? Clarify?
**Addendum**
I also noticed that in one of the wizard isles campaign maps there was an issue where an enemy hero with a super powerful starting army would often portal directly to your starting area around turn 6 or 7 and at that point it was basically impossible to win because he would attack you right away and it was pretty much literally impossible to beat that army without cheating. You had to keep reloading until the random teleport network didn't happen to take him directly to your portal next to your castle so you could have enough time to build up a decent army. I can't say I ever played this wizard isle campaign map, originally, but I can't believe this was the way that map was intended to play out originally.
Hi, phamtrinil!
The AI is completely remade from scratch in fheroes2 since the whole engine is remade, none of the original source code is used. In other words the original AI hasn't been meddled with since it is not even present.
The maps you're mentioning are still beatable by following very specific tactics, basically the same as you would in the original game for the second map of the Price of Loyalty(PoL) campaign: get creatures fast and by the second week you should have gone north and started taking over castles. Use a barbarian hero, so reload until you get that. These are the same steps guides for the original game give. Many of those scenarios were badly designed originally imo and forced you to save and reload to get the better spells etc.
The new AI is better in many places but still needs to be improved. However, the PoL campaign was probably balanced specifically for the often dumb original AI so that any human opponent taking its place would have a ridiculous advantage against you, just take a look at all the resource boosts the AI gets from scripts by opening campaign maps in the editor and you will understand what I'm talking about.
Nevertheless, there are talks about making changes so that the original unfair advantages of the AI are lessened.
BTW the last release made it possible to choose different difficulties for the campaigns so you could try that.
I didn't see any option to change difficulty of campaign when I started it (pol)
I updated to the new version, set the campaign difficulty on Easy, then re-tried this map.
Here is the result:
This is not possible. My 1 army which has all the creatures you can physically possibly get in this amount of time on this map, vs 4 armies (just on this screen) like this?
I say there is something wrong with this campaign map / AI. This is not beatable.
And this was on "Easy"...
And before anyone says "I could beat that" - put your money where your mouth is and upload a yt video of you beating this army of:
35 orcs, 51 archers, 10 orc chiefs, 10 ogre lords and 12 wolves in an enemy hero that has 3 atk, 2 def, 1 sp, 2 knowl
with a hero that has 9 grand elves, 18 battle dwarves, 36 sprites, 6 druids
Heck, I'd even accept a video that just shows you beating this enemy army on turn 13 on this map, with whatever you're able to put together by then without cheating!
This is not possible. My 1 army which has all the creatures you can physically possibly get in this amount of time on this map, vs 4 armies (just on this screen) like this?
I say there is something wrong with this campaign map / AI. This is not beatable.
And this was on "Easy"...
Hi, phamtrinli.
I was actually doing a playthrough of this map, but I encountered a bug with saving in the latest snapshot build of fheroes2 that I was testing. This bug is solved now. (Also I never actually play with saving and reloading but I would say that map can permit it.)
Before uploading any vid I can give some advice already like buying a barbarian hero from the castle to use as your main hero. You need to play quickly so those 3+ in attack are essential. Also I'm suprised you don't have upgraded druids. Make sure to grab gold as the starter bonus and take gold from all chests.
The best strategy for the map I could find is on the mightandmagic fandom page for this specific scenario. I can't post links yet so hopefully you'll be be able to find it. If not I can share some of the points here. Basically, the strategy there is what I've been using to beat the map several times on what is now Normal difficulty.
I believe before I had troubles with the save I was able to capture the red barbarian castle to the north west week 2 day 4 or something, just in time to avoid red player from getting those troops.
The Price of Loyalty campaign is the hardest one I've played and it really requires you to know the intricacies of the game to win, and reloading until you get the right starter hero...
But the enemy managed to field 97 hydras (among many other things) despite only having 3 warlock castles. I'm not even sure how that's possible unless the AI cheats big-time with unit count / starting unit count on this map!
This map was significantly harder on "Easy" than arteris 2 on Impossible. What the actual fuck??
I guess I'm just lucky I got to them before they started magically producing 14 black dragons per week
The trick that finally got me passed the first hurdle was to forgo getting my 2nd level mage guild and get upgraded druids instead, get the barbarian hero as suggested and just rush north (not picking anything up, not flagging anything) and get to the barbarian castle and stay there for 2 weeks to get the barbarian troops there and smash a couple of their powerful heroes, then take the northern-most barbarian castle right after that. And even after I had a weeks worth of two castles worth of barbarian troops, I was still just narrowly beating each battle, with some very creative tactics...
But the enemy managed to field 97 hydras (among many other things) despite only having 3 warlock castles. I'm not even sure how that's possible unless the AI cheats big-time with unit count / starting unit count on this map!
This map was significantly harder on "Easy" than arteris 2 on Impossible. What the actual fuck??
I guess I'm just lucky I got to them before they started magically producing 14 black dragons per week
Great job! Yes, the AI does indeed cheat in this map. As I said earlier, you can open these campaign maps in the editor and see that the AI gets extra resources and starts with quite powerful armies and heroes. To open them just change the filetype to a normal map type.
There are some other tricky maps later on so don't let your guard down
So I'm 4 more maps into the campaign now and all of them were super easy except this latest one (7)
I ran into multiple armies of 150-200 pikemen and swordsmen, 50+ champions each, 130-200 rangers each and one with 68 crusaders
This is ridiculous
I don't know if you ever managed to beat that scenario but I just found this Youtube channel which manages to beat that campaign. It's in Polish but the solution can still be understood I figure: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_RCgX4wqSS8&t=1262s&ab_channel=ABlackHorse
not sure why but the armies he was running into were far FAR weaker than what I was running into (about 1/3 the strength on avg)
He seems to be using a build from before the difficulty option was made. From the looks of it he was running the version 0.9.17 from July. The only AI change between those the release you must've been using and the one he used was indeed that the AI champion role was made, which does so that the AI tries to create one very strong hero with more troops instead of spreading the troops among several heroes.
Your assessment of 1/3 of the forces is therefore pretty on spot since the AI usually has 3-4 heroes, so the forces would have been divided between them.
I wonder if this person would have been able to beat that campaign on the very latest release...
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